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Date: 23 Feb 2006 11:12:29
From:
Subject: King and Rook vs King and Knight
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Is this a book draw or a win for the K+R
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Date: 24 Feb 2006 14:15:57
From: doctorjohn
Subject: Re: King and Rook vs King and Knight
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[email protected] wrote:
> Is this a book draw or a win for the K+R<<
"Fundamental Chess Endings", by Muller and Lamprecht is the only
endgame book I have used, so I have nothing to compare it to.
I seem to recall that usually K+R can force a win vs. K+N if he can
separate them but not if the K+N stay close together. I vaguely recall
an example of K+N even stopping a pawn from queening in K+N vs K+R+P,
but the K+N had to be placed just right (side by side on the eigth rank
in front of the pawn on the sixth rank, or something like that).
But that's a vague recollection from reading a year ago, by a
beginner... so I might be wrong. I would suggest that book, it does
seem pretty comprehensive and well researched.
Dr. J
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Date: 23 Feb 2006 23:03:39
From: CeeBee
Subject: Re: King and Rook vs King and Knight
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[email protected] wrote in rec.games.chess.analysis:
> Is this a book draw or a win for the K+R
wK+R vs. bK+N (or with reversed colours):
White mates in 40: 16 (0%)
White mates in 39: 96 (0%)
White mates in 38: 288 (0%)
White mates in 37: 872 (0%)
White mates in 36: 1360 (0%)
White mates in 35: 3064 (0,01%)
White mates in 34: 4768 (0,02%)
White mates in 33: 7144 (0,03%)
White mates in 32: 11024 (0,04%)
White mates in 31: 14488 (0,06%)
White mates in 30: 21124 (0,09%)
White mates in 29: 25544 (0,1%)
White mates in 28: 39740 (0,17%)
White mates in 27: 55304 (0,23%)
White mates in 26: 71664 (0,3%)
White mates in 25: 84980 (0,36%)
White mates in 24: 101244 (0,43%)
White mates in 23: 117708 (0,5%)
White mates in 22: 126880 (0,54%)
White mates in 21: 141480 (0,6%)
White mates in 20: 168532 (0,72%)
White mates in 19: 221756 (0,95%)
White mates in 18: 318968 (1,36%)
White mates in 17: 491088 (2,1%)
White mates in 16: 706464 (3,02%)
White mates in 15: 853748 (3,66%)
White mates in 14: 707044 (3,03%)
White mates in 13: 578360 (2,48%)
White mates in 12: 438408 (1,88%)
White mates in 11: 307240 (1,31%)
White mates in 10: 264220 (1,13%)
White mates in 9: 213716 (0,91%)
White mates in 8: 109692 (0,47%)
White mates in 7: 90180 (0,38%)
White mates in 6: 67004 (0,28%)
White mates in 5: 30368 (0,13%)
White mates in 4: 26004 (0,11%)
White mates in 3: 39580 (0,16%)
White mates in 2: 35680 (0,15%)
White mates in 1: 69552 (0,29%)
White mates in 0: 9328 (0,04%)
� white mates in 15,07 (28,2%)
Drawn: 16740224 (71,79%)
Black mates in 0: 8 (0%)
Black mates in 1: 32 (0%)
--
CeeBee
*** The Cookie Has Spoken ***
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Date:
From: Martin Brown
Subject: Re: King and Rook vs King and Knight
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Date: 24 Feb 2006 20:52:52
From: CeeBee
Subject: Re: King and Rook vs King and Knight
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tin Brown <
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Date: 24 Feb 2006 15:14:49
From: Antonio Torrecillas
Subject: Re: King and Rook vs King and Knight
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En/na tin Brown ha escrit:
> CeeBee wrote:
>> [email protected] wrote in rec.games.chess.analysis:
>>> Is this a book draw or a win for the K+R
>> wK+R vs. bK+N (or with reversed colours):
>>
>> � white mates in 15,07 (28,2%)
>> Drawn: 16740224 (71,79%)
>> Black mates in 0: 8 (0%)
>> Black mates in 1: 32 (0%)
>
> What is perhaps more interesting is what heuristics should each player
> adopt. The mate has to be against the edge of the board so a decent
> black strategy is keep K & N off the same rank or file and the king near
> the middle of the board. The optimum moves for white are harder to see
> and with a typical mate in 15 or more I find it hard to distinguish a
> distant forced win from a draw without consulting the oracle.
An strange win can be done in positions where the knight is trapped (and
the king is far and can not defend it) or there are a double attack K-N
which produces knight being lost.
In normal positions it's an easy draw.
> The obvious ones of trying to force the black king to the edge and avoid
> setting up a knight fork seem insufficient.
>
> Any suggestions for simple rules of thumb for winning with restricted
> pieces in varying combinations?
>
> Although tablebases play a perfect game their optimum strategy is too
> devious and obscure to be memorable.
>
> Suggestions for a suitable endgame book please?
>
> Regards,
> tin Brown
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Date: 24 Feb 2006 12:54:29
From: Ray Gordon
Subject: Re: King and Rook vs King and Knight
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> Any suggestions for simple rules of thumb for winning with restricted
> pieces in varying combinations?
In this case, the rook can gain time over the knight through triangulation,
thus forcing it into unfavorable positions.
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Date: 24 Feb 2006 10:03:01
From: Tony M
Subject: Re: King and Rook vs King and Knight
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On 23 Feb 2006 23:03:39 GMT, CeeBee <[email protected] >
wrote:
>[email protected] wrote in rec.games.chess.analysis:
>
>> Is this a book draw or a win for the K+R
>
>
>wK+R vs. bK+N (or with reversed colours):
>
>White mates in 40: 16 (0%)
>White mates in 39: 96 (0%)
>White mates in 38: 288 (0%)
>White mates in 37: 872 (0%)
>White mates in 36: 1360 (0%)
>White mates in 35: 3064 (0,01%)
>White mates in 34: 4768 (0,02%)
>White mates in 33: 7144 (0,03%)
>White mates in 32: 11024 (0,04%)
>White mates in 31: 14488 (0,06%)
>White mates in 30: 21124 (0,09%)
>White mates in 29: 25544 (0,1%)
>White mates in 28: 39740 (0,17%)
>White mates in 27: 55304 (0,23%)
>White mates in 26: 71664 (0,3%)
>White mates in 25: 84980 (0,36%)
>White mates in 24: 101244 (0,43%)
>White mates in 23: 117708 (0,5%)
>White mates in 22: 126880 (0,54%)
>White mates in 21: 141480 (0,6%)
>White mates in 20: 168532 (0,72%)
>White mates in 19: 221756 (0,95%)
>White mates in 18: 318968 (1,36%)
>White mates in 17: 491088 (2,1%)
>White mates in 16: 706464 (3,02%)
>White mates in 15: 853748 (3,66%)
>White mates in 14: 707044 (3,03%)
>White mates in 13: 578360 (2,48%)
>White mates in 12: 438408 (1,88%)
>White mates in 11: 307240 (1,31%)
>White mates in 10: 264220 (1,13%)
>White mates in 9: 213716 (0,91%)
>White mates in 8: 109692 (0,47%)
>White mates in 7: 90180 (0,38%)
>White mates in 6: 67004 (0,28%)
>White mates in 5: 30368 (0,13%)
>White mates in 4: 26004 (0,11%)
>White mates in 3: 39580 (0,16%)
>White mates in 2: 35680 (0,15%)
>White mates in 1: 69552 (0,29%)
>White mates in 0: 9328 (0,04%)
>� white mates in 15,07 (28,2%)
>Drawn: 16740224 (71,79%)
>Black mates in 0: 8 (0%)
>Black mates in 1: 32 (0%)
What program do you use to generate this output?
Tony
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Date: 24 Feb 2006 20:49:12
From: CeeBee
Subject: Re: King and Rook vs King and Knight
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Tony M <[email protected] > wrote in rec.games.chess.analysis:
> What program do you use to generate this output?
http://www.geocities.com/rba_schach2000/
--
CeeBee
*** The Cookie Has Spoken ***
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Date: 24 Feb 2006 00:33:28
From: Toni Lassila
Subject: Re: King and Rook vs King and Knight
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On 23 Feb 2006 11:12:29 -0800, [email protected] wrote:
>Is this a book draw or a win for the K+R
Yes.
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Date: 23 Feb 2006 21:05:03
From: Ray Gordon
Subject: Re: King and Rook vs King and Knight
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K+R can win in 387 moves from any position.
<[email protected] > wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Is this a book draw or a win for the K+R
>
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