Your viewpoint

Date: 12 Oct 2005 10:02:59
From:
Subject: Your viewpoint

Recently I played this French defense against friend{ I lost }and
I keep getting the feeling I play the opening wrong.8...BxNt right or
wrong ?? 1.e4,e6.2.d4,d5,3.nc3,nf6,4.e5,nd7,5.Bb5,a6,6.Bd3,c5,
7.PxP,BxP,8.f4,Bxn,9.rxb,Qh4+10.Kf1,Qxh2,11.Be3,Nc6,12.ne2,f5,15.
c3,Qh5,16.Ke1,pb5,17.g4,g6,18.. What is the best line to play?

Thanks

Date: 23 Oct 2005 03:58:40
From: matt -`;'-
Subject: Re: Your viewpoint

<[email protected] > wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> Recently I played this French defense against friend{ I lost }and
> I keep getting the feeling I play the opening wrong.8...BxNt right or
> wrong ?? 1.e4,e6.2.d4,d5,3.nc3,nf6,4.e5,nd7,5.Bb5,a6,6.Bd3,c5,
> 7.PxP,BxP,8.f4,Bxn,9.rxb,Qh4+10.Kf1,Qxh2,11.Be3,Nc6,12.ne2,f5,15.
> c3,Qh5,16.Ke1,pb5,17.g4,g6,18.. What is the best line to play?
>
> Thanks
>

My simple thoughts:

1. e4 e6 2. d4 d5 3. Nc3 Nf6 4. e5 Nfd7 {All looks about standard so far.} 5.
Bb5 a6
{This move looks good because it removes the pin and also provides a base for b5 later, and also enables c5 without having to waste
a move by c6 first, which in turn provides the taking of more space by the pawns, which is good for black because of the cramped
position found on the black side of the french.}

6. Bd3 c5 7. dxc5 Bxc5
{I wonder if 7...Nxc5 would have been better as it attacks the d3 bishop.}

8. f4 Bxg1
{This does destroy castling to this side, but it loses the bishop which will matter if the center opens up. Never-the-less this
move interests me.}

9. Rxg1 Qh4+ 10. Kf1 Qxh2 11. Be3 Nc6 12. Ne2 f5 13. c3 Qh5 14. Ke1 b5 15. g4 g6
{Black appears the better by having castling options, but creating an attack looks difficult for both sides. Neither king is easily
assailable. The only hope for a good attack by black is to open up a file or 2 to make free squares for piece development. Notice
how locked up the pieces are and how the knights have little development potential, and how the bishop is a prisoner and how the
rook is idle. Castling queenside offers to bring the rook over to the kingside to assist in a power play. Still it will take some
assistance from the bishop and knights -so pawns have to fall for a good attack to flourish.}
*

Date: 23 Oct 2005 16:29:31
From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Claus-J=FCrgen_Heigl?=
Subject: Re: Your viewpoint

matt -`;'- wrote:
> My simple thoughts:
>
> 1. e4 e6 2. d4 d5 3. Nc3 Nf6 4. e5 Nfd7 {All looks about standard so far.} 5.
> Bb5

This move is almost never good in the French. Characteristic of this
position is that the center is closed and that there are the pawn chains
d4-e5-(c3-f4) versus f7-e6-d5. The pawn chains are fixed and the black
squared white bishop and the white squared black bishop are restricted
in their mobility by the own pawn chains. The restricted bishops are
therefore called "bad bishops". The other bishops are called "good"
because they are not restricted in their movement by their own pawns.
One standard strategy is to keep the good bishop and trade off the bad.
The result is an overall better mobility of your pieces. The other
strategy is to break the pawn chains and open up the position so that
the bad bishop is no more restricted.

In this position White has more space and the black position is somewhat
cramped. This means Black has some difficulties to manouvre his pieces
around, so Black likes to trade making more room. White doesn't like to
trade because he wants Black's pieces cramped while his own are more
free to move because of more space. This translates to White wanting to
keep the pawn chain closed and not trading pieces, and Black breaking up
the pawn chain and trading pieces.

The standard plan of White is to attack the kingside with pieces. White
can deploy his pieces on the kingside easily while Black's pieces are
hindered to come to the defense because of the pawn chains. White also
often advances the f-pawn to reinforce the center (e5) and if e5 is
secure, maybe open the f-file with a further advance (f5). Black's
standard plan is to attack the pawn chain with c5 and maybe f6. Black
then seeks to advance his pawn center. To succeed in this plan control
over e5 is crucial. Sometimes Black seeks to trade his bad bishop first
by deploying it on the a6-f1 diagonal.

If White wants to keep his pawns in the center he has the options of
Nce2 with the plan c3 after Black attacks with c5 or immediately f4
which reinforces e5. Also possible is Nf3 with the plan to keep control
over e5 with pieces (Bf4, Qe2). The idea is if Black manages to remove
the white pawns from the center (with c5, f6) Black mustn't be able to
set his pawn center e6-d5 in motion.

So Bb5 hat not much of a purpose. It does pin the Nd7 but this pin can
be broken easily. White in principle does not want to trade his bishop
for the knight, because the bishop can be used very well in a attack
against the kingside.

> a6
> {This move looks good because it removes the pin and also provides a base for b5 later, and also enables c5 without having to waste
> a move by c6 first, which in turn provides the taking of more space by the pawns, which is good for black because of the cramped
> position found on the black side of the french.}

a6 is a good move but it gives White a chance to maintain the pawn chain
by trading the bishop against the knight removing one attacker of e5
(yes, the Nd7 is an attacker!). I think c6 may be the best move for
Black. It denies White the possibility to trade the bishop and after
5...c6 6. Be2 (or 6. Bd3 c5 7. Nf3 (7. Nce2 is not possible because of
7...c4) 7...cxd4) 6...c5 7. Nf3 Nc6 White has trouble with his center.

> 6. Bd3

Giving up the center. 6. Bxd7 Nxd7 7. Nf3 (or 7. Nce2 c5 8. c3) 7...c5
8. Ne2 keeps control of d4 and e5.

> c5 7. dxc5 Bxc5
> {I wonder if 7...Nxc5 would have been better as it attacks the d3 bishop.}

Of course 7...Nxe5 was the move to play. The white center is totally
destroyed and the pawn at c5 is in serious danger if not lost. The
development advantage of White is not enough of a compensation. Black
will get a mobile pawn center so the white strategy has totally failed.

> 8. f4

This opens the diagonal a7-g1 and White is getting problems with his
king safety. 0-0 is no more possible. A better way to reinforce e5 was
Nf3 followed by Bf4 and perhaps Qe2. The attack 8. Qg4 looks
interesting. This has been made possible because the Bc5 is protecting
g7 no more. 8...g6 is weakening the black squares on the kingside, White
then can develop with Nf3 and has good attacking chances. 8...Qc7 with
the idea 9. Qxg7 Qxe5+ is refuted by 9. Bf4 g6 10. Nf3 Nc6 11. 0-0
Ncxe5? 12. Nxe5 Nxe5 13. Qg5 Bd6 14. Qf6 Rg8 15. Nxd5! exd5 16. Bxe5
(16...Bxe5 17. Rfe1) and White has a superior position. But 8...Bf8! 9.
Nf3 Nc6 10. Bf4 d4 11. Ne2 Qa5+ (aims for e5) looks quite playable for
Black. If Black controls the center the kingside is safe.

> Bxg1
> {This does destroy castling to this side, but it loses the bishop which will matter if the center opens up. Never-the-less this
> move interests me.}

Black exploits the last move by winning a pawn. As a consequence the
black queen will get out of play. The alternative was to develop and
prepare an attack on the queenside looking what the white king is up to.

> 9. Rxg1

A good alternative was 9. g3 Qxh2 10. Be3. White has lost a pawn but in
turn has got a lot of development advantage and the black queen might be
in danger after a later Qf3 and Rh1. The queen can be retracted to
safety after Nc6-b4xd3 and Qh6-Qg6 but this gives White even more time
to develop his kingside and center attack (g4, f5).

> Qh4+ 10. Kf1 Qxh2 11. Be3

Setting up the pieces for a fork at d4 is bad. Interesting was 11. g3 to
deny the escape of the black queen via h4. The plan is of course Qf3 and
Rh1. If 11...Nc5 with the plan Nxd3 it follows 12. Be2 with the plan 13.
Rg1 Qh6 14. Kg2. Black has difficulties to extract his queen.

> Nc6

11...d4! 12. Bxd4 Qxf4+ 13. Bf2 Nxe5 wins another pawn and destroys the
center. After Nc6 the advantage of Black is mostly gone.

> 12. Ne2 f5 13. c3

White should be more aggressive here. 13. Kf2 (threat Rh1) 13...Qh4+ 14.
g3 15. c4 and as the position opens White's development advantage gives
good attacking chances.

> Qh5 14. Ke1

If the plan was to move the king to the queenside before attacking on
the kingside, this is a bit slow. If you have a development advantage
the best strategy is to exploit it is by opening up the position fast.
You will have more pieces in the attack than the opponent has to defend.
So 14. c4 was still the move. This either weakens the black center
seriously (cxd5) or opens both c and d file for an attack. There is no
need to delay the attack further because Black may spoil the White
chances by b5 or g5 any time now.

> b5 15. g4

Perhaps better to move the king first to d2 to give back White the full
control over the first rank (Rh1) and to enable White putting a rook on
the e-file after it opens (this could be the case after 15. Kd2 g5 16.
Qc2 gxf4 17. Nxf4 Qf7 18. Be2 Ndxe5 19. Bh5 Ng6 20. Rae1 with the plan Bd4).

> g6

This has to be an error as White can take the queen now. 15...fxg4 16.
Kd2 g5 17. Qc2 gxf4 18. Nxf4 Qxe5 19. Rae1 is rather unclear. Black has
a good material advantage but White has a big development advantage and
the position is quite open.

Claus-Juergen

Date: 28 Oct 2005 14:22:40
From: Ray Gordon
Subject: Re: Your viewpoint

>> My simple thoughts:
>>
>> 1. e4 e6 2. d4 d5 3. Nc3 Nf6 4. e5 Nfd7 {All looks about standard so
>> far.} 5.
>> Bb5
>
> This move is almost never good in the French.

The computers often use it to slip in a quick Qe2+ so that Black can't get
his Bishop to d6.

Date: 28 Oct 2005 21:58:50
From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Claus-J=FCrgen_Heigl?=
Subject: Re: Your viewpoint

Ray Gordon wrote:
>>>1. e4 e6 2. d4 d5 3. Nc3 Nf6 4. e5 Nfd7 {All looks about standard so
>>>far.} 5. Bb5
>>
>>This move is almost never good in the French.
>
> The computers often use it to slip in a quick Qe2+ so that Black can't get
> his Bishop to d6.

Do you mean in the exchange variation? In the closed French Qe2+ isn't
possible.

Claus-Juergen

Date: 13 Oct 2005 18:42:08
From: Lawrnce
Subject: Re: Your viewpoint

I believe now that the pawn grab was wrong
because thats how the game played out.
White development was a big factor.The
pawn wasn't worth it. It was a 25minute game and going after a pawn was
wrong.I wasn't developed and my kingside was a
target...

Date: 12 Oct 2005 19:06:02
From: chasmad
Subject: Re: Your viewpoint

Ray Gordon wrote:
> > Recently I played this French defense against friend{ I lost }and
> > I keep getting the feeling I play the opening wrong.8...BxNt right or
> > wrong ?? 1.e4,e6.2.d4,d5,3.nc3,nf6,4.e5,nd7,5.Bb5,a6,
>
> Try 5...c6 next time.

?? What a total patzer.

Date: 12 Oct 2005 13:54:31
From: Bateman
Subject: Re: Your viewpoint

No, a6 is best. bxd7 is rubbish. You need to play c5 quickly anyway so
why waste time with c6? After bb5? a6 bd3 c5 be3 nc6 you win a pawn. c6
is anti positional.

Date: 12 Oct 2005 20:44:10
From: Ray Gordon
Subject: Re: Your viewpoint

> Recently I played this French defense against friend{ I lost }and
> I keep getting the feeling I play the opening wrong.8...BxNt right or
> wrong ?? 1.e4,e6.2.d4,d5,3.nc3,nf6,4.e5,nd7,5.Bb5,a6,

Try 5...c6 next time.

Date: 13 Oct 2005 09:53:13
From:
Subject: Re: Your viewpoint

Ray Gordon wrote:
>>Recently I played this French defense against friend{ I lost }

yeah well e5 is better than e6 obviously
:)

Date: 12 Oct 2005 21:25:25
From: Ron
Subject: Re: Your viewpoint

In article <[email protected] >,
"Ray Gordon" <[email protected] > wrote:

> > Recently I played this French defense against friend{ I lost }and
> > I keep getting the feeling I play the opening wrong.8...BxNt right or
> > wrong ?? 1.e4,e6.2.d4,d5,3.nc3,nf6,4.e5,nd7,5.Bb5,a6,
>
> Try 5...c6 next time.

Since Bxd7 seems silly, and Bd3 essentially amounts to giving black the
move ...a6 for free (and it's a move often played in these positions) I
think a6 is a completely legitimate choice of move here.

The real question is whether the pawn grab with Bxf1, Qh4+ & Qxh2 is
worth the pain that results - I think black can wind his way through the
complications but he's basically ruling out kingside castling and
spotting white a big lead in development.

-Ron

Date: 12 Oct 2005 12:40:27
From: Bateman
Subject: Re: Your viewpoint

You were black and you lost!!?? White's opening is dross. 5.Bb5 is
dumb...why not 7..nxe5? Either way you should have walked this.

Date: 12 Oct 2005 10:19:06
From: Lawrnce
Subject: Re: Your viewpoint

Sorry.1e4,e6 2.d4,d5 3.nc3,nf6 4.e5,nd7 5.Bb5,a6 6.Bd3,c5 7.PxP,BxP
8.f4,BxN 9.rxn,qh4+ 10.kf8,qxh2 11be3,nc6 12.ne2,f5 13.c3,h5 14Ke1,pb5
15.a3,bb7 16.ke2,qf7 17.g4,c6
18.qf1,na5 19.kc2,nc4. best line.

Date: 12 Oct 2005 10:19:01
From: Lawrnce
Subject: Re: Your viewpoint