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Date: 22 Feb 2005 01:56:35
From: Harry Balzac
Subject: Fritz V. CM9000
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I've been watching this group for a few days and have noticed something
disconcerting.
Fritz seems to be the gold standard when one discusses computer analyses of
alternative moves. I have Fritz Chessmaster Challenge and it seems to be a
pretty good chess challenger and allows me to simply set up a board
position. I suspect it is a stripped down version of the uber-Fritz
software (the $10 price tag at Electronic Boutique was also a clue.)
I have been using CM9000 to improve my game and it seems to offer
everything I wanted in teaching and analysis software. I've played a few
games against computer personalities near what I thought my skill level was
(and lost miserably) and then printed out the game analyses and I think
they are helpful. Have I backed the wrong horse here? Is Fritz better at
teaching and analysis than CM?
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Date: 07 Mar 2005 20:59:30
From: Mike Ogush
Subject: Re: Fritz V. CM9000
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On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 01:56:35 GMT, Harry Balzac <[email protected] >
wrote:
>I've been watching this group for a few days and have noticed something
>disconcerting.
>
>Fritz seems to be the gold standard when one discusses computer analyses of
>alternative moves. I have Fritz Chessmaster Challenge and it seems to be a
>pretty good chess challenger and allows me to simply set up a board
>position. I suspect it is a stripped down version of the uber-Fritz
>software (the $10 price tag at Electronic Boutique was also a clue.)
>
>I have been using CM9000 to improve my game and it seems to offer
>everything I wanted in teaching and analysis software. I've played a few
>games against computer personalities near what I thought my skill level was
>(and lost miserably) and then printed out the game analyses and I think
>they are helpful. Have I backed the wrong horse here? Is Fritz better at
>teaching and analysis than CM?
CM is better at teaching. Tutorials are included in CM9000. For
tutorials to use with Fritz you have to buy additional software.
Fritz is better at tactical analysis. [I wouldn't trust a computer's
trategic/positional analysis just yet.] However, the qualitatiev
difference between Fritz's and CM's analysis is not very noticable to
mere humans until you reach master level or beyond.
If you are still interested in getting Fritz a less expensive option
is to get the revision just prior to the current one. [On eBay ans
on-line vendors the cost of Fritz 7 is about half the cost of Fritz
8].
Mike Ogush
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Date: 22 Feb 2005 13:13:15
From: Henri Arsenault
Subject: Re: Fritz V. CM9000
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In article <[email protected] >, Harry Balzac
<[email protected] > wrote:
>I've been watching this group for a few days and have noticed something
>disconcerting.
>
>Fritz seems to be the gold standard when one discusses computer analyses of
>alternative moves. I have Fritz Chessmaster Challenge and it seems to be a
>pretty good chess challenger and allows me to simply set up a board
>position. I suspect it is a stripped down version of the uber-Fritz
>software (the $10 price tag at Electronic Boutique was also a clue.)
>
I am not familiar with the version of Fritz that you mention, but I have
Fritz 8, and Chessmaster 9 and 10.
Chessmaster is bettter for tutorials, and its opponents are more
human-like. But chessmaster SAYS that the program was not designed
specifically for playing strength nor analysis (although it DOES play at
grandmaster strength).
Fritz is apparently stronger (although no one below Kasparov strength can
beat either progream at full strength), and its analysis features are
without peer. It allows moving up and down the analysis tree without
losing the rest of the game, and adding analysis to the game all the
while, which Chessmaster does not. Its other analysis features are also
top notch. Fritz also allows creating your own opening trees for
practicing openings, which is superior to Chessmaster's opening practice
features.
In sum, for playing against the computer, learning, and tutorials ,
Chessmaster is better. For game analysis, Fritz (or any other Chessbase
computer game with the same GUI) is vastly superior.
That is why I have both programs...
Henri
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Date: 22 Feb 2005 07:40:21
From: David Vancina
Subject: Re: Fritz V. CM9000
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Henri Arsenault wrote:
<snip >
> In sum, for playing against the computer, learning, and tutorials ,
> Chessmaster is better. For game analysis, Fritz (or any other Chessbase
> computer game with the same GUI) is vastly superior.
>
> That is why I have both programs...
>
> Henri
Hmmm... maybe I'll go get me a copy of CM10 too. Father's day is
coming, after all. :-)
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Date: 06 Mar 2005 07:11:06
From: bellatori
Subject: Re: Fritz V. CM9000
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In terms of opening preparation and analysis, the new Chess Base 9.0 has
some very good new features. It has a new reference feature which is like
Opening report but much quicker. Fritz 8.0 is good at analysis when in
infinite mode but you don't see its true value until you use its deep
position analysis. With an AMD 64 with 1GB+ of memory so that you can use
large hash tables it is positively awesome. A minimum of 15 ply ....
Have to say that I agree about the interface. Not exactly crisp,
uncluttered and user friendly!
Bellatori
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Date: 21 Feb 2005 20:39:06
From: David Vancina
Subject: Re: Fritz V. CM9000
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Harry Balzac wrote:
> I've been watching this group for a few days and have noticed something
> disconcerting.
>
> Fritz seems to be the gold standard when one discusses computer analyses of
> alternative moves. I have Fritz Chessmaster Challenge and it seems to be a
> pretty good chess challenger and allows me to simply set up a board
> position. I suspect it is a stripped down version of the uber-Fritz
> software (the $10 price tag at Electronic Boutique was also a clue.)
>
> I have been using CM9000 to improve my game and it seems to offer
> everything I wanted in teaching and analysis software. I've played a few
> games against computer personalities near what I thought my skill level was
> (and lost miserably) and then printed out the game analyses and I think
> they are helpful. Have I backed the wrong horse here? Is Fritz better at
> teaching and analysis than CM?
I hear they're both pretty good. I own Fritz 8 and while I like the
analysis features I think the UI is pretty horrible. (Maybe the
organization makes sense in German.) Either one (Fritz or CM9K) has an
engine strong enough to kick the average human's butt from here to
eternity, so unless you're well above average I'd submit it doesn't much
matter which you choose. For that matter, I like the free program
Crafty pretty well too!
Have fun!
DJV
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