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Date: 15 Oct 2006 13:32:29
From: Yahoo Ben Yoda
Subject: Sanny is a nice person
Having followed your efforts, I want to applaud your positive attitude. I
tried to play a game a couple of months ago and somehow the game froze. I
have not gone back, but I will when I have a chance.

Best wishes on your program improving!







 
Date: 21 Oct 2006 06:32:38
From: Wlodzimierz Holsztynski (Wlod)
Subject: Re: Sanny is a nice person
Dave (from the UK) wrote:

> What does Sanny's site have to offer that
> I can't get better for free elsewhere?

For the price of enduring just one session
at Sanny's site you can claim sainthood,
and you also earn the eternal privilege of
making fun of Sanny.

Enjoy while it lasts :-)

Wlod



 
Date: 20 Oct 2006 21:45:21
From: help bot
Subject: Re: Sanny is a nice person

Dave (from the UK) wrote:

> > Yeah, you said his HTML was flawed and gave a Web
> > site where he could check it for free -- very helpful.
>
> I did a lot more than that. I tried explaining to him why this might be
> important - not everyone uses whatever version of IE he used. I tried
> telling him that Firefox was used a lot, but he insisted 99% of his
> users had Netscape or IE.


Although I did download a version of IE, I have yet to try
it to see if there is any improvement with the GetClub site.
I simply use Firefox, and although there have been a few
problems with emails which occasionally display garbage
characters instead of, say, a quotation k, on the whole
it works rather well. One exception is that several times
I have found myself trying to type out a message here,
only to have the apostrophe key hijacked by an update
which pops up a "helpful" screen each time I hit that key.


> My opinion might be a minority of one, but I feel he is not worth
> helping, as he does not try to help himself.


Several people have taken offense at his repeated,
preposterous claims of improvements and fixes. But
over time, Sanny has in fact made substantial
improvements to his program. As a self-confessed
weak chess player, Sanny is at a serious disadvantage
to many of us in terms of chess knowledge.


> I'm just puzzled at all the interest in a commercial company that has a
> poor chess game. There are much better ones for free. FICS is free so
> one can play online.


It's the big prize money which ensnares us.


> What does Sanny's site have to offer that I can't get better for free
> elsewhere?


Fame. Glory. Stardom. And of course, the babes.



> > But your comments about the looks being poor are not
> > specific enough to do much good.
>
> I suspect you have not looked at all my comments. But as I say, I've
> since given up, as I feel its just a waste of my time.


That leaves more babes for me and Pfuscher!


-- help bot



 
Date: 20 Oct 2006 00:53:10
From: help bot
Subject: Re: Sanny is a nice person...but he will never beat nomorechess

Tony M wrote:

> The inability of Sanny's program to complete moves in a given amount
> of time has nothing to do with any inherent weakness in Java. Java
> applets such as Jester
> (http://www.ludochess.com/jester_eng/jester_eng.php3), Little
> ChessPartner (http://www.lokasoft.nl/jchess/chessgame.htm) and the
> Java port of the Winboard engine TSCP
> (http://english.op.org/~peter/ChessApp/#applet) are all perfectly
> capable of playing moves within an allotted time frame.
>
> Sanny has not figured out how to properly test for a timeout, and to
> interrupt a search when a timeout is reached. I suggest that Sanny's
> "team" read the source of the TSCP port. TSCP was meant as an
> instructional program, so it is clearly written and can hopefully
> prove useful.


The complaints regarding the program not playing in
the *claimed* timeframes do not concern me much,
since I can easily adapt to the reality. What annoys
me is that the program will sometimes backtrack,
re-analysing a ply which it earlier had completed,
moving on to the next one. This is the priy
problem I am having now, and it seems to indicate
that slow analysis is not necessarily the root of the
problem, but rather, chasing its own tail is.

I have had several games lately where at one point
in the game, I slipped and allowed some annoying
tactical problems. Each time the program let me slip
away unscathed, and I have gone on to win. But these
little slip-ups are a sure sign that Sanny's program is
getting closer and closer. Apart from certain endgames
in which there is no resistance, the program's style is
reasonably close to that of a human player -- albeit one
who is prone to human error.

-- help bot



 
Date: 19 Oct 2006 21:29:53
From: help bot
Subject: Re: Sanny is a nice person

Dave (from the UK) wrote:

> I'll do the same with Sanny. Unless Sanny offers to start paying me for
> feedback on his web site, then I will not bother. I've given him some
> (the fact the HTML is seriously broken, it looks poor etc)


Yeah, you said his HTML was flawed and gave a Web
site where he could check it for free -- very helpful.
But your comments about the looks being poor are not
specific enough to do much good.

IMO, the chessboard looks great; in fact, it wouldn't
surprise me if it was "lifted" from a commercial chess
program. The oversized board, OTOH, is too big to
fit on my "widescreen" laptop computer's display.
Several of the comments on the site mangle the
English language (easy to fix). But the number one
complaint has to be the thinking time, which may well
be the result of using Java, although attempts to extract
information about this fall on deaf ears.

-- help bot



  
Date: 20 Oct 2006 21:10:02
From: Dave (from the UK)
Subject: Re: Sanny is a nice person
help bot wrote:
> Dave (from the UK) wrote:
>
>
>>I'll do the same with Sanny. Unless Sanny offers to start paying me for
>>feedback on his web site, then I will not bother. I've given him some
>>(the fact the HTML is seriously broken, it looks poor etc)
>
>
>
> Yeah, you said his HTML was flawed and gave a Web
> site where he could check it for free -- very helpful.


I did a lot more than that. I tried explaining to him why this might be
important - not everyone uses whatever version of IE he used. I tried
telling him that Firefox was used a lot, but he insisted 99% of his
users had Netscape or IE.

My opinion might be a minority of one, but I feel he is not worth
helping, as he does not try to help himself.

I'm just puzzled at all the interest in a commercial company that has a
poor chess game. There are much better ones for free. FICS is free so
one can play online.

What does Sanny's site have to offer that I can't get better for free
elsewhere?

> But your comments about the looks being poor are not
> specific enough to do much good.

I suspect you have not looked at all my comments. But as I say, I've
since given up, as I feel its just a waste of my time.


--
Dave (from the UK)

Please note my email address changes periodically to avoid spam.
It is always of the form: [email protected]
Hitting reply will work for a few months only - later set it manually.

http://witm.sourceforge.net/ (Web based Mathematica front end)


  
Date: 20 Oct 2006 06:00:55
From: Tony M
Subject: Re: Sanny is a nice person
On 19 Oct 2006 21:29:53 -0700, "help bot" <[email protected] >
wrote:

>
>Dave (from the UK) wrote:
>
>> I'll do the same with Sanny. Unless Sanny offers to start paying me for
>> feedback on his web site, then I will not bother. I've given him some
>> (the fact the HTML is seriously broken, it looks poor etc)
>
>
> Yeah, you said his HTML was flawed and gave a Web
>site where he could check it for free -- very helpful.
> But your comments about the looks being poor are not
>specific enough to do much good.
>
> IMO, the chessboard looks great; in fact, it wouldn't
>surprise me if it was "lifted" from a commercial chess
>program. The oversized board, OTOH, is too big to
>fit on my "widescreen" laptop computer's display.
> Several of the comments on the site mangle the
>English language (easy to fix). But the number one
>complaint has to be the thinking time, which may well
>be the result of using Java, although attempts to extract
>information about this fall on deaf ears.
>
> -- help bot

The inability of Sanny's program to complete moves in a given amount
of time has nothing to do with any inherent weakness in Java. Java
applets such as Jester
(http://www.ludochess.com/jester_eng/jester_eng.php3), Little
ChessPartner (http://www.lokasoft.nl/jchess/chessgame.htm) and the
Java port of the Winboard engine TSCP
(http://english.op.org/~peter/ChessApp/#applet) are all perfectly
capable of playing moves within an allotted time frame.

Sanny has not figured out how to properly test for a timeout, and to
interrupt a search when a timeout is reached. I suggest that Sanny's
"team" read the source of the TSCP port. TSCP was meant as an
instructional program, so it is clearly written and can hopefully
prove useful.

Tony


 
Date: 19 Oct 2006 05:00:42
From: Sanny
Subject: GetClub Chess has reached good hights.
> Again: needs said: most chessplayers, that are giving the bad reviews, are
> themselves probably unable to programm a decent chess engine.
> I hope Sanny will make a great programm, listens to the reviews, and stops
> angling for compliments.
> Greetings from Ruud.
> > Best wishes on your program improving!
> >

Nowadays, the Game is playing Quite Well. But now it is very difficult
to improve it further.

Now there are little modifications needed but what are they is a big
mystry. Can anyone Tell Them.

Players like Richardby and Patidar are loosing each game they play.
While Strong Players are beating each game.

The Problem here is My Game Level is as below

Beginner: 1600
Easy: 1650
Normal: 1700
Master: 1750
Advance: 1800.

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html

Players with 1700-1800+ ratings can win it everytime.

One can see only Top 5 Players are winning the Game easily While rest
100 Players are Loosing the Game each time they Play.

Top Players will always win as they use Opening Books Not yet Learnt by
my Game.

But I am happy to see 90% of the Players are loosing with my Game.

Bye
Sanny

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html



 
Date: 19 Oct 2006 05:15:30
From: Ruud
Subject: Re: Sanny is a nice person

"Yahoo Ben Yoda" <[email protected] > wrote in message
news:[email protected]
Do you have proof for that statement?

> Having followed your efforts, I want to applaud your positive attitude. I
> tried to play a game a couple of months ago and somehow the game froze. I
> have not gone back, but I will when I have a chance.

It's nice to see someone doing their best to make a good chessprogramm.
Reading the reviews from chessplayers here, it seems that the programmer's
effords are either with nothing but the best intentions (since he himself
claims his programm is great, where others say it's not, it seems Sanny has
a different opinion about what 'good chessplay' is, plays on a different
level alltogether, or is unaware of the requirements of good chessplay of
engines. It's however very strange, that he keeps insisting it's good enough
for all, were other's say it's not. It seems he doesn't want to hear about
the reviews at all, and only wants everyone to agree with him. That does not
a nice person make (who listens to everyone, with an open mind)).
Again: needs said: most chessplayers, that are giving the bad reviews, are
themselves probably unable to programm a decent chess engine.
I hope Sanny will make a great programm, listens to the reviews, and stops
angling for compliments.
Greetings from Ruud.
> Best wishes on your program improving!
>
>
>




  
Date: 18 Oct 2006 23:40:49
From: Yahoo Ben Yoda
Subject: Re: Sanny is a nice person
"Ruud" <It seems he doesn't want to hear about the reviews at all, and only
wants everyone to agree with him. That does not a nice person make (who
listens to everyone, with an open mind)).
>

On the other hand, the guy is doing it for free; for a bunch of people that
sound like they would love to piss on his grave just because he is not
Anatoly Karpov.




   
Date: 19 Oct 2006 11:44:54
From: Dave (from the UK)
Subject: Re: Sanny is a nice person
Yahoo Ben Yoda wrote:
> "Ruud" <It seems he doesn't want to hear about the reviews at all, and only
> wants everyone to agree with him. That does not a nice person make (who
> listens to everyone, with an open mind)).
>
>
> On the other hand, the guy is doing it for free; for a bunch of people that
> sound like they would love to piss on his grave just because he is not
> Anatoly Karpov.
>
>

What makes you think he is doing it for free?

http://www.getclub.com/Secured/Purchase_Games.php?Game=10.00

has the prices of the games. The first 30 are free, then

# Purchase 16 Games for US$ 2.00 only.
# Purchase 40 Games for US$ 5.00 only.
# Purchase 100 Games for US$ 10.00 only.
# Purchase 225 Games for US$ 20.00 only.
# Purchase 600 Games for US$ 50.00 only.
# Purchase 1200 Games for US$ 100.00 only

Send MO/Draft in favor of GetClub.com
At Address:
GetClub.com, C-33, Chandranagar,
AB Road, Indore-452008 (India).

So he is doing this to try to make money. Somehow I don't think he ever
will...., but he is trying to do this as a business.

I've not played a single game on there - the front page is so off
putting and all the bug reports, make me not want to waste my time.

I wrote some open-source software for antenna design some time back

http://www.g8wrb.org/yagi/

(which incedentely was one of the first attempts at using genetic
algorithms for antenna design)

Someone from India was asking about it and I gave him some advice. He
then wanted me to send him Autocad drawings for an antenna for a
specific frequency, with a specific gain etc. As soon as I asked for
some money, that was the last I heard from him.

I'll do the same with Sanny. Unless Sanny offers to start paying me for
feedback on his web site, then I will not bother. I've given him some
(the fact the HTML is seriously broken, it looks poor etc), but that is
as far as it will go for me. I've got better things to do than provide
commercial companies feedback, using my time to benefit them.

I really am amazed at the amount of time people spend playing games and
giving reports on his "commercial" site.

--
Dave (from the UK)

Please note my email address changes periodically to avoid spam.
It is always of the form: [email protected]
Hitting reply will work for a few months only - later set it manually.

http://witm.sourceforge.net/ (Web based Mathematica front end)


   
Date: 19 Oct 2006 12:14:45
From: Ruud
Subject: Re: Sanny is a nice person

"Yahoo Ben Yoda" <[email protected] > wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> "Ruud" <It seems he doesn't want to hear about the reviews at all, and
> only
> wants everyone to agree with him. That does not a nice person make (who
> listens to everyone, with an open mind)).
>>
>
> On the other hand, the guy is doing it for free; for a bunch of people
> that
> sound like they would love to piss on his grave just because he is not
> Anatoly Karpov.

I must say, I'm somewhat bemused by the constant claims of the programm's
greatness ('now it's making great moves, on all levels'), and then reading
reviews saying: 'Sanny it's not true', trying to get him to stop claiming
greatness (I'm sure it's not to make him stop trying to develope
alltogether ).
People don't listen to eachother anymore these days, nor care about
eachother's feelings.
In a way it's st what he does. He gets free feedback on his attempts to
programm., where his target is probably just people that are new at chess.
In a world where there are so many top level chessprogramms, he's also in a
way the little kid, new at chess, who keeps suggesting moves, on a table
where GM's are analysing games.
The GM's find him a little annoying, cause he's disturbing the
conversations, but tolerate the little one, cause he's addorable in his
attempts, and tries so hard to do his best.
Ruud.




   
Date: 19 Oct 2006 04:56:32
From: Ron
Subject: Re: Sanny is a nice person
In article <[email protected] >,
"Yahoo Ben Yoda" <[email protected] > wrote:

> On the other hand, the guy is doing it for free; for a bunch of people that
> sound like they would love to piss on his grave just because he is not
> Anatoly Karpov.

I don't know if it's nice or not. He certainly seems big-hearted.

But he also has a certain destructive blindness, and, quite frankly,
he's dishonest. He repeatedly makes claims about his program which are
simply false.

Now, the most charitable way to read that is a certain naive optimism,
which is forgivable. I don't know if he's entitled to that charitable a
reading at this point, you'd think he'd get the point eventually.

But, hey, it's up to him.

-Ron


 
Date: 16 Oct 2006 08:37:14
From: Wlodzimierz Holsztynski (wlod)
Subject: Re: Sanny is a nice person
Yahoo Ben Yoda wrote:

> Have you found a cure for genital herpes?

Go to a drugstore, they may help you
(my background is mathematics, not medicine).

Wlod



 
Date: 16 Oct 2006 01:42:33
From: Sanny
Subject: Chess game CHALLENGE
> Ask Sunny -- why? He will explain that
> yopu need a new computer, new operating
> system (even if he doesn't understand the
> words), a faster connection, and don't you
> dare to refresh the window (or was it: refresh
> it every 5 seconds?). It's your imperfect
> world versus his higness perfectness.
>

Now no such problem is there, 1000s of games have been played by 100s
of players and they all are finding hard to win and get high ratings.

Open Challenge to Everyone.

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html

ANYONE OUT THERE WHO CAN BEAT NOMORECHESS & TAYLOR KINGSTON RECORDS.
They are the Top players at GetClub Chess.

Bye
Sanny

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html



 
Date: 16 Oct 2006 01:38:02
From: Sanny
Subject: Thanks, for praising GetClub.com Chess.

Yahoo Ben Yoda wrote:
> Having followed your efforts, I want to applaud your positive attitude. I
> tried to play a game a couple of months ago and somehow the game froze. I
> have not gone back, but I will when I have a chance.
>
> Best wishes on your program improving!

Thanks for your Appraisals !!!

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html

I remember those days when everyone was making fun of my Game and
slowly everyone understood that the Game is really nice.

Still 2-3 people are feeling the game is playing bad but with your
appraisals soon they will also praise the Game. As now it makes good
Moves in Less time.

If you want further improvements in the game inform me the improvements
you are looking for, And if possible that will be done.

Bye
Sanny.

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html



  
Date: 16 Oct 2006 11:56:14
From: Yahoo Ben Yoda
Subject: Re: Thanks, for praising GetClub.com Chess.
"Sanny" < > Still 2-3 people are feeling the game is playing bad but with
your
> appraisals soon they will also praise the Game. As now it makes good
> Moves in Less time.
>

There are many miserable, bitter old men involved in chess. Don't let it
bother you.




 
Date: 15 Oct 2006 19:41:11
From: Wlodzimierz Holsztynski (Wlod)
Subject: Re: Sanny is a nice person
Yahoo Ben Yoda wrote:

> "Wlodzimierz Holsztynski (Wlod)"

> > By all means, tell us how it went.
> > So far you are but a troll.
> >
>
> What are you besides a miserable old man waiting to die?

I told you, you are a troll.

It was so easy. Just a bit of scrapping you,
and your true, ugly nature showed to everybody
to see. There are trolls and trolls. You are
a crude troll, not entertaining, just boring.

Wlod



  
Date: 15 Oct 2006 23:45:35
From: Yahoo Ben Yoda
Subject: Re: Sanny is a nice person
"Wlodzimierz Holsztynski (Wlod)" < > It was so easy. Just a bit of scrapping
you,
> and your true, ugly nature showed to everybody to see.>>

It did not take any scrapping for your true, ugly nature to come forth.
Unfortunately for your family, you don't have any other side of your
personality. There is just Wlod, the SLOB.

Have you found a cure for genital herpes?




 
Date: 15 Oct 2006 14:26:44
From: Wlodzimierz Holsztynski (Wlod)
Subject: Re: Sanny is a nice person
Yahoo Ben Yoda wrote:

> Having followed your efforts, I want to applaud
> your positive attitude. I tried to play a game a
> couple of months ago and somehow the game froze.

Ask Sunny -- why? He will explain that
yopu need a new computer, new operating
system (even if he doesn't understand the
words), a faster connection, and don't you
dare to refresh the window (or was it: refresh
it every 5 seconds?). It's your imperfect
world versus his higness perfectness.

> I have not gone back, but I will when
> I have a chance.

By all means, tell us how it went.
So far you are but a troll.

> Best wishes on your program improving!

All Sanny's steam goes not into his engine
but into his whistle.

Wlod



  
Date: 15 Oct 2006 20:57:28
From: Yahoo Ben Yoda
Subject: Re: Sanny is a nice person
"Wlodzimierz Holsztynski (Wlod)" < > By all means, tell us how it went.
> So far you are but a troll.
>

What are you besides a miserable old man waiting to die?